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support
Whole Tomato Software
5566 Posts |
 Posted - Jun 23 2004 : 3:18:35 PM
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http://www.wholetomato.com/downloads/VA_X_Setup1240.exe
Fixes are described at:
http://www.wholetomato.com/support/history.html
We offer this build first to private beta users. We made some decent changes to the UI for suggestion listboxes. We want your feedback before we release to a larger audience. When we do, we update our web site.
A suggestion listbox no longer contains scrollbars -- a ploy to make you press down arrow to see "more" which really opened a completion listbox. You must now press Ctrl+Space to see a completion listbox when a suggestion listbox is open.
We like the new UI ourselves. Much more sane.
The change in UI lets us again have suggestions when typing in the middle of, or in front of, a symbol. Wahoo!
VS.NET users do not need to reset toolbars during install to get the fixes in this build. Last build requiring reset is 1214. (Build 1241 will likely require a reset.)
No changes to code templates in this build. |
Whole Tomato Software, Inc. |
Edited by - support on Jul 03 2004 12:48:21 PM |
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Uniwares
Tomato Guru
Portugal
2321 Posts |
Posted - Jun 23 2004 : 8:34:50 PM
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| The history sounds promising and justifies the long wait. Installing right now. |
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WannabeeDeveloper
Tomato Guru
Germany
775 Posts |
Posted - Jun 24 2004 : 03:01:01 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by support
A suggestion listbox no longer contains scrollbars -- a ploy to make you press down arrow to see "more" which really opened a completion listbox. You must now press Ctrl+Space to see a completion listbox when a suggestion listbox is open.
Question:
Does that mean that I always have to Ctrl+Space to get a Completion-listbox when a suggestion Listbox is open? I liked the fact that I could "expand" the suggested symbols by just pressing down arrow when on the last entry. Sometimes when I'm using structs with "Show bits of surrounding code" enabled, I get only 2 or 3 of the members shown (when there are lots more in the struct), so I always knew that pressing down arrow shows them all. Learning to press a completely different key-combination could be quite tough for my over-exhausted brain...
Didn't install 1240 yet (damn TimeZones), but will this evening... |
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Cezariusz
Tomato Guru
Poland
244 Posts |
Posted - Jun 24 2004 : 04:25:42 AM
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quote:
Misspelled symbols are underlined even if they appear in the dictionary
My English is not good enough to understand what does it mean. Can you explain it to me, please? |
Cezariusz Marek
https://midicat.net/ |
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Stephen
Tomato Guru
United Kingdom
781 Posts |
Posted - Jun 24 2004 : 04:41:44 AM
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Cezariusz: I understand it to mean this: When you're typing code (not comments), mis-spelled variable names are underlined, even if a word of the same name happens to be in the dictionary. For example:
int tige = 2;
tiger *= 2;
tiger is mis-spelled and should be underlined, even though tiger is an English word. |
Stephen Turner
ClickTracks http://www.clicktracks.com/
Winner: ClickZ's Best Web Analytics Tool 2003 & 2004
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Cezariusz
Tomato Guru
Poland
244 Posts |
Posted - Jun 24 2004 : 06:01:31 AM
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| Thanks Stephen, now I get it. The word "symbol" seems to be the key to understand the feature. |
Cezariusz Marek
https://midicat.net/ |
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feline
Whole Tomato Software
United Kingdom
18939 Posts |
Posted - Jun 24 2004 : 10:07:32 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by WannabeeDeveloper
Does that mean that I always have to Ctrl+Space to get a Completion-listbox when a suggestion Listbox is open?
based on some initial experiments with 1240, yes it does.
personally i prefer this. every time i saw scroll bars on a completion listbox i had this massive urge to use up and down to scroll up and down the completion list.
this seems to be deeply ingrained. i see a scroll bar, and i instantly want to know what is hidden at the top or the bottom.
when the option i want isn't in the completion listbox i normally type a few more characters. this normally results in the correct option popping up in a new completion listbox, and saves me having to scroll through the suggestion listbox to find what i want. |
zen is the art of being at one with the two'ness |
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Stephen
Tomato Guru
United Kingdom
781 Posts |
Posted - Jun 24 2004 : 11:13:42 AM
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Which is of course exactly why the scrollbar was on the suggestion listbox -- to make you do this.
I don't like having to press Ctrl+Space to get the completion listbox, but I'll probably get used to it.
Restoring suggestions in the middle of words is a big gain though. Thank you for that. |
Stephen Turner
ClickTracks http://www.clicktracks.com/
Winner: ClickZ's Best Web Analytics Tool 2003 & 2004
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support
Whole Tomato Software
5566 Posts |
Posted - Jun 24 2004 : 12:12:24 PM
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Our vision of interaction between VA X and the user is consistent with feline's actions. Type. See a few suggestions. If not there, type another character or two. See if VA X can guess correctly. Only when you want to quit the game do you need to type Ctrl+Space.
Luring Stephen into pressing down arrow to see more options was our intention. We think we were misguided. Hence, Stephen will have to get used to Ctrl+Space.
Stephen, listboxes with question marks contain suggestions, not complete lists. This is why you see only a few members occasionally. Press Ctrl+Space to see more; keep typing to get a better suggestion.
We should say we changed the UI in part because Larry pounded on us. We would open a suggestion listbox and Larry wanted to move the cursor down a line. We opened a completion listbox when he pressed down arrow. Very annoying. Our quick fix was to disable suggestions when not at the end of a line, give or take a bit. We knew the real fix was something else. |
Whole Tomato Software, Inc. |
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LarryLeonard
Tomato Guru
USA
1041 Posts |
Posted - Jun 24 2004 : 12:46:49 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by support
We should say we changed the UI in part because Larry pounded on us. We would open a suggestion listbox and Larry wanted to move the cursor down a line. We opened a completion listbox when he pressed down arrow. Very annoying. Our quick fix was to disable suggestions when not at the end of a line, give or take a bit. We knew the real fix was something else.
Ahem. I stand by my pounding.  The current behavior (1240) is a vast improvement, in my opinion - much less obtrusive. Thanks!
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feline
Whole Tomato Software
United Kingdom
18939 Posts |
Posted - Jun 24 2004 : 1:02:20 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Stephen
Restoring suggestions in the middle of words is a big gain though. Thank you for that.
i never actually had that, since i came in at VAX.
i have just had this happen to me while adding a variable in front of a function call  suddenly gaining this is a *major* bonus |
zen is the art of being at one with the two'ness |
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Uniwares
Tomato Guru
Portugal
2321 Posts |
Posted - Jun 24 2004 : 7:05:00 PM
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well, Ctrl+Space somehow almost never works for me  |
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support
Whole Tomato Software
5566 Posts |
Posted - Jun 24 2004 : 7:14:08 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Uniwares
well, Ctrl+Space somehow almost never works for me
Do you mind starting another thread with this one? |
Whole Tomato Software, Inc. |
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Uniwares
Tomato Guru
Portugal
2321 Posts |
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WannabeeDeveloper
Tomato Guru
Germany
775 Posts |
Posted - Jun 25 2004 : 02:35:28 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by LarryLeonard
Ahem. I stand by my pounding. The current behavior (1240) is a vast improvement, in my opinion - much less obtrusive. Thanks!
I second that!
Overall "work-flow" is much smoother now. Although I thought I would miss the "down-arrow", I am not!
Now just fix the Bugs Uniwares found (didn't find the time yet to try them) and we're back on the road again! |
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